|
Gazette
|
Mar 13th, 2008 at 07:09pm |
The Gazette coverage is up.
http://www.dalgazette.ca/
Thoughts?
Comments:
Ian says:
[Mar 13th @ 07:28pm]
Only one not directly relevant to the DSU elections... the Gazette mentions a "potential ban" of KSU members from voting on DSU society elections. VAJ then said something irrelevant about how she didn't want them banned entirely, but would agree with whatever the SRC decided.
... leaving aside VAJ's utterly impotent response, KSU members are already barred from voting/executive positions in DSU societies. So are community members. This has been in the society policy for a long time, it just hasn't been enforced until now. Both KSU and community members are allowed to participate, they just can't vote.
... and yes, I'm going to keep repeating this until people get it right.
western observer says:
[Mar 13th @ 07:33pm]
Is Tara Gault serious? "Strangest dream: I had a dream that we had a fully sustainable campus."
*gag*
Give me Stalin over this cheesefest any day.
Ian, Part Deux says:
[Mar 13th @ 07:51pm]
Coffin's plan for a night bus seems... unlikely. Metro Transit can't afford to put routes it needs on the road, why would it add a late-night driver for a bunch of drunks? No other routes run that late. I guess they could run their own bus, but they don't run Tiger Patrol that late either.
VAJ can apparently put her leg over her head. Remember folks, your internal choice... she also mentions giving students a voice in how their sustainability office is run. Since we have a Dalhousie one as well, how about disbanding it and putting the money to better use? Maybe I just don't understand.
Both VPSLs can roll their tongues. That's, uh, that's cool.
Osmond: For the love of all that is good and holy, leave the T-Room alone. It's the only bar that is (was?) making money, and people actually go to it. Keep your DSU touch of death to yourself.
Eric: Hey, remember that time you lost eleventy-billion dollars because you skipped a shift of work to play poker (and lose)?.
Eric Snow says:
[Mar 13th @ 07:51pm]
Ian:
You're correct at the moment, but the new policy, assuming it passes, is going to have potential exceptions to that rule. I don't want to get in depth, as the matter isn't finalized, but there will be an agreement drafted that both student unions will sign that will allow students to form "joint societies". Students from the union other than the DSU (likely to be generally KSU) will be able to run, vote and hold executive positions.
There will be certain conditions. At least one executive needs to be a member of the DSU as it stands now. Only members of the DSU will sit on the Council. And members of other unions who are members of the society are responsible to the DSU for their actions in relation to the society. However, membership in these societies will be equal.
Not all societies will be eligible for joint status. The Gazette is an exception, because it was mandated by a specific referendum. Referendum-mandated societies (the ones that receive levies) will have specific rules that apply to them based on the referendum that determined their existence.
The issues of relations with the KSU, and King's students serving on DSU societies, are all being raised over a handful of King's students on the Gazette. The possibility of restricting them from contributing was never seriously considered, and the idea of preventing them from being editors was rejected. The only thing they can't do is vote. And it's a Dalhousie student newspaper, paid for by Dalhousie students.
As far as I'm concerned, the King's editors and staff at the Gazette are getting some pretty amazing treatment as it is. As far as the way other societies are being treated, that's all contingent on the final Society Policy, but suffice it to say there's no controversy between the KSU and the DSU, despite what the Gazette (and the Watch) say.
If only we had a student newspaper that would put the hard facts to the students. Unfortunately, it's the student newspaper that's at the center of this controversy.
mike says:
[Mar 13th @ 07:55pm]
"If only we had"?
I think you meant to say "Imagine a student newspaper..."
Or, "I had a really strange dream last night, where we had a student newspaper..."
Eric Snow says:
[Mar 13th @ 07:56pm]
Ian: I remember the time after that when I took your money, if that's what you mean.
Also, as an addition to my last post, the Watch coverage of the Society Policy issue was about a quarter of a page, and more accurately addressed the new DSU Society Policy in relation to King's students than anything I've read in the Gazette.
Ian says:
[Mar 13th @ 08:02pm]
I'm not too concerned about the societies that don't receive a levy. If they're not spending student funds, it's really not that big a deal.
The ones that receive them are the ones that tend to be run by non-students: CKDU, NSPIRG, the Women's Centre, the Gazette etc.
There's a compromise I'd love to see... nix the DSU member requirement in exchange for requiring levies to be reapproved every X years. That would be a far better way to keep societies responsive to the needs of DSU members.
Chris Nickerson says:
[Mar 13th @ 08:35pm]
Ian - requiring that levies be re-approved every few years would be a great idea even apart from DSU membership requirements. It would go a long way to ensuring financial accountability on the part of societies that receive a levy. Not that I have any societies in mind. *Cough*.
AEB says:
[Mar 13th @ 08:43pm]
I THINK CHRIS NICKERSON IS TALKING ABOUT NSPIRG. ARE YOU CHRIS? ARE YOU?
(If not why the hell not? Lets talk about a society that seriously needs the loss of a levy...)
Gareth says:
[Mar 13th @ 09:13pm]
Just to weigh in with some numbers, as I can be wont to do:
1) Gazette has all the honoraria wrong - All exectutives will be getting same pay (cons. change) and the gross take home after a few years of CPI increases (~2%/YoY) is a little more than 27k.
2)TRoom in the notice of motion budget from last night is on track for a 7k profit in FY08/09. This FY will post a 1.6k loss, all of which is due to refurbing a dead dishwasher.
mike says:
[Mar 13th @ 09:28pm]
And to add historical numbers, as I am prone to do:
- T-Room posted a profit of just over $10k in 04-05, as well. Gareth, and every VPFO before him, will tell you that you can't directly compare the two, but that they are happy to see the T-Room's budget red-free.
- The Grawood has been known to lose $100,000+ in a year since it moved to its current location.
- If anyone still remembers the Old Grawood, it did better financially. A problem was it wasn't big enough - the line up stretched outside and around the block. Increasing the size increased overhead, staffing costs, and insurance costs... plus people stopped going.
Chris Nickerson says:
[Mar 13th @ 09:42pm]
AEB - Maybe.
western observer says:
[Mar 13th @ 09:47pm]
The old Grawood was busy and successful because it was a campus pub - not a cheesy Palace knockoff. Cozy vs. crass, fun vs. lame...
Has anyone seen the SMU pub? Now that's what a campus pub SHOULD be. Who knew SMUSA had more vision than the DSU...
Chris Nickerson says:
[Mar 13th @ 09:58pm]
Anyone else think Hillman's "favourite unusual food combo" is genius? "Baby seal with a side of fried Piping Plover". John, I might vote for you based on that alone.
Antics Observer says:
[Mar 13th @ 10:02pm]
I agree, when you're in the Gorsebrook (SMU pub) you feel like you're at the university... although I like the grawood, the picnic tables, and fencing at the back feel like the indoor outdoor club in A Night at the Roxbury (Which I should note was a great joke because it was an utterly indefensible joke of a design). Everyone involved in the DSU enjoys the Grawood because of the people they know who go there, which evidently, isn't that many people from the entirety of the Dalhousie community.
Antics Observer says:
[Mar 13th @ 10:04pm]
To correct myself: I meant fence at the back, if it were swordplay that would be an entirely different story. I want to see more swordplay in my campus pub.
western observer says:
[Mar 13th @ 10:10pm]
Antics observer, the people involved with the DSU like the Grawood because they often get free drinks... hell, if a bar gave me free Keith's, I'd be all over it too.
John Packman says:
[Mar 13th @ 11:18pm]
Eric:
The reason there are King's students on the paper is that journalism students HAVE TO go to King's to take journalism. How many times do we have to say that? Dal only offers students a minor through King's but gives them the option to switch schools if they want to major. We understand that the society policy issue will not ban non-Dal students from participating in societies, but banning them from voting on some of those societies is a big deal.
We're not trying to say that Dal students aren't capable of running a student newspaper. But no one at The Gazette really cares which union is paying our health plan or who is organizing our frosh week. If journalism students at The Gazette could switch schools to avoid all this bullshit, we would. But the fact is, we can't.
Giving Gazette staff members who go to King's a chance to vote at our elections gives the people who have worked at the paper for years a chance to help elect our future staff.
It's a big deal when any student government is tampering with the way the student paper is run and students have a right to know. Implying we're doing this because we're petty is a tremendous insult.
As for as the comment on your blog: "I believe we need to make the opportunities to get involved with the Gazette clear to Dalhousie students, and that we shouldn't underestimate them." Well, we've been talking to classes, friends and anyone who shows the slightest interest in anything Gazette-related, with absolutely no regard to whether they are Dal or King's students. And we advertise how to get involved in our paper every single week. Anyone who picks up The Gazette will see multiple ads telling him or her how to get involved and when our next meeting is (March 17, room 312 of the SUB).
Should more students be part of The Gazette? Absolutely. Should ideas about how The Gazette is run be part of political platforms? Absolutely not.
western observer says:
[Mar 13th @ 11:34pm]
Maybe the Gazette should be an independent newspaper. Pay rent, get rid of the levy and stand on its own two feet. Then we could see how valuable all that King's Journalism experience actually is.
Another option would be to get rid of the cliquiness - not enough Dal contributors? Try walking into that third floor office without already having an in.
Mark Coffin says:
[Mar 13th @ 11:38pm]
The gazette also included the Course Evaluations as part of the VP Ed's responsibilities. This is no longer accurate, as course evaluations haven't been done for years, and were formally removed from the portfolio at the 2008 DSU AGM.
James Munson says:
[Mar 13th @ 11:42pm]
Dear 'western observer,'
The Gazette's integrity and reputation hinges on being accessible to all students. It would be great if you could please give some evidence of people being rejected from the gazette because they weren't part of a clique, instead of blasting The Gazette with such a off-hand comment that can really stick to people who don't come into the office. 'Us' vs 'Them' is an easy diatribe to expound, and very believable to people who don't make the slightest effort to get to know 'them.' It's an altogether different question whether or not it's true.
Eric Snow says:
[Mar 14th @ 01:39am]
John:
I see that you're taking this seriously, so I'd prefer to discuss this personally, as you have also indicated. I would like to say, though, that I completely agree with your statement that the Gazette shouldn't be part of political platforms.
Actually, I think the way I put it on my website may have been misleading, and I'll fix that. The fact that this issue is being debated during the elections is an unfortunate coincidence. Its presence on my website is minor, and only intended to be part of my discussion of what has been occurring over the campaign period. I'm not running on the Gazette issue, and I don't believe anyone else (except perhaps someone in the Gazette elections) should be, either.
I don't think you're being petty. I do understand that it's a big deal. The main reason I've been frustrated, and this is the reason I posted here in the first place, is because the focus on the Gazette has completely obscured the real progress that has been made with joint societies in general, and the progress we have made working with the KSU. First and foremost, I wanted to set the record straight on the issues beyond the Gazette.
Gregory Debogorski says:
[Mar 14th @ 01:57am]
The Gazette is cliquish, I know two ladies that right for it and they tell me so.
Second, King's students have no right to vote, they are lucky to be given a chance to participate.
Third, the Gazette should be an election issue, and people shouldn't pussy foot around the issue. Conflict can be constructive.
The Gazette has major potential to be a channel the DSU uses to cure its apathy problem. It obviously is not the only solution, but a strong ingredient to the cure.
The strong presence and say King's students have in the Gazette has caused some Dal students concerns, myself included since finding out about it, which will lead to negative attitudes about the Gazette and potentially the DSU.
In the right context and with the right partnership, the Gazette can be used as notice/sounding board for much of what the DSU is up against.
Eric Snow says:
[Mar 14th @ 02:30am]
Debogorski:
The Gazette shouldn't be campaign issue. The reason for that is the general hands off approach the DSU takes to the Gazette to ensure quality of writing, and that it doesn't become a propoganda puppet.
The issues that arose this year were to prevent the Society Review Committee from breaking the existing policy, and/or lying to the student population.
John Hillman says:
[Mar 14th @ 02:32am]
I might as well add my perspective on the notion of cliquishness, given that I'm a Dal student who writes for the Gazette.
In my first two years at Dal I had always written offbeat blog entries for the amusement of my friends. They often told me that I should be writing for the Gazette, so one day I decided to take their advice. I sent off a short humorous piece for some feedback as to whether it was the sort of thing the Gazette printed. For several days I didn't hear back from anyone, and assumed that the answer was likely negative. I had run into the clique mentality with my high school paper, and I figured that it was possibly resurfacing.
That Thursday I picked up the Gazette, as usual, and found my article printed in it. I knew absolutely no one on the paper at the time, yet they printed my article nonetheless. I heard back from the opinions editor shortly thereafter, and she gave me all the positive feedback I could have hoped for. I've been writing for the paper ever since, and I've never once had a problem with getting my work published, even though I've written some questionable material from time to time. Even after a few years writing, I'm not part of a Gazette clique of any sort, and I doubt that 95% of the members would recognize my face if they ran into me (at least before this campaign started).
Essentially, I guess my point would be that while there are King's students working at all levels of the paper, I've never felt marginalized. If anything, I've found the editorial staff quite keen to encourage participation from those who are outside of the "inner circle."
Gregory Debogorski says:
[Mar 14th @ 02:40am]
This is a serious issue, because the Gazette holds one of the keys for a cure of student apathy.
King's should not have voting rights, but be granted participation.
Gareth says:
[Mar 14th @ 04:54pm]
The honoraria changes to the constitution were not part of the most recent changes, they have been referred to the BoOps for discussion.
As such for 08-09 fiscal year the honoraria are:
President, VPI, VPFO:
Gross is 27,056 a year before taxes, EI, CPP.
VPED, VPSL:
Gross is 24,966.44 a year before taxes, EI, CPP.
These are both a 2.2% increase over the previous year as per the January CPI numbers (http://www.bankofcanada.ca/en/cpi.html). This is latest full year data available.
|
